Build a Better ERP Evaluation Framework A Nonprofit Leader’s Guide to Making the Right Choice 

 
Bri-anna Ramsden   0:08
Hello everyone. We'll give a minute or so to get some more people in here, but very excited to see everyone joining our webinar today.
So thank you for joining. Today we're having A. webinar that is titled How to Build an ERP Evaluation Framework for Nonprofit Organizations. For those of you that haven't joined before, I'm going to do some quick housekeeping. So if you have any questions throughout the session, we do have A. chat and Q&A function.
Put your questions in there and near the end we have saved some time for us to answer them. We have everyone muted and I'm asking our speakers because I know at my house I have A. lot of cats that like to take over the show. We'll mute ourselves when not talking.
Just so we don't have the extra background noise, and this webinar will be sent out to you within five business days for you to review whether you've missed the session, you've hopped on late, or you wanna share with your team.
So quick agenda, we are going to do an overview of Sparkrock, then talk about the ERP evaluation framework, what you can expect and how you should build it. Then the most exciting part is our fireside chat with Megan Ikram and closing out with A. Q&A.
Now I'll do A. quick introduction for these two, but I'll let them do most of the chatting themselves. But we're very excited to have Megan Ikram join us today. Meg currently works at Sparkrock, but she used to be A. director of finance at A. nonprofit and has implemented ERPS and technology solutions. And then Ikram is the CFO at.
National Arts Center has lots of experience in the non-profit sector, but also has implemented an ERP and both of them can give us A. lot of practical experience. So I'll pass it along to Meg to get us started.

 
Meg Wilson   2:20
Great. Well, thank you, Brianne. Before I jump in today's topic, as Brianne said, I want to give a quick overview of of who Sparkrock is, what we do and what sets us apart. Some of you may be familiar with us, others are not. So I'll try to keep it brief.
So Sparkbox was designed specifically for nonprofits. We understand the mission-driven priorities and how they affect your operation and your technology needs. So if you look at this slide, I'm sure many of you on this call today can relate.
To some of these, if not all of these requirements that are very unique for nonprofits.
So again, we at Sparkrock as an organization, we actually serve over 100,000 users who manage over $15 billion a year in finances. So we're super proud of that number. We've been in this space for 20 plus years working alongside our.
Partners, our customers to constantly evolve and respond to our customer needs. So we've got 135 employees who are really dedicated to this nonprofit space and that includes a product team, sales like myself who came from the nonprofit sector and a customer success team, a lot of whom also came from the nonprofit.
Profit sector.
Yeah.
So what makes us unique is that we are built on the Microsoft Business Central platform. So we've been a Microsoft partner for for many, many years. Microsoft offers a fantastic product in term of a whole ecosystem, which again, I'm sure many of you are using.
And and really, really great ERP functionality that meets the needs of of organizations globally. But what Microsoft doesn't have is that very specific non-profit functionality and they look for partners like Sparkrock to offer that.
So what does that mean for our customers? Well, what it means is that they get the best of both worlds. So you get this amazing platform, this Microsoft platform that offers all the privacy and security that's really critical in today's world. You get investment protection because Microsoft's got this global base.
Of customers that are fueling ongoing investment into the product, you get all the things that are really complicated for a very sector specific partner to provide things like the mobility support, interoperability with different applications.
And then even user face like user interface, things are evolving all the time. So it's expensive to stay on top of that. And that's the stuff that Microsoft takes care for Sparkrock so that we can focus on the things that matter to customers like yourselves. And most excitingly right now is where Microsoft.
Microsoft is going with Open AI and Copilot. We've got so many enhancements coming this next year. I'm super excited. Stuff that Microsoft's put into the product and then stuff that Sparkrock's doing to actually take that to the next level for our nonprofit customers.
So then speaking of Sparkrock, here's where we come in on that horizontal platform. We have the very vertically focused solution that has those nonprofit specific features that you saw on this slide earlier, a really tailored experience.
And then beyond just that, the community we create, like one of the things we really pride ourselves on is the fact that we're not only offering technology solution, we're creating a community. We're helping people share ideas so that we can continue to enhance our product, but also continue to support our customers on the.
Process side and that's where our customer success managers come in, which is also really critical as part of that whole experience we provide as a partner. And then also the fact that you get the Microsoft embedded quality, you know we're developing based on Microsoft standards.
So you know that you're getting a quality product and then as I mentioned, we're optimizing A I. So we've got some really fantastic features that are going to help our clients be much more effective using the platform that's available from Sparkrock and Microsoft.
So I wanted to explain a little bit about me and my background. As as Brie said, I worked as a as a in the non-profit sector actually for for about a decade and prior to that I was in for-profit. I've been involved in many ERP implementations, but I had the wonderful.
Opp.
To lead a transformation. And that was like everything from infrastructure all the way through to front end solutions, back end solutions. And man, I loved it. I learned so much and there was something really empowering about being part of setting up an organization.
For future efficiency versus sort of the finance work that I was used to doing. And you know what, I didn't have a technical background because this is very much about people and process and being able to sit back and analyze those and be very strategic on how you're going to get buy in. And I just found it such an.
Amazing challenge. And I decided after that experience that this is what I wanted to do for a career. And within a year after that project went live and was successful, I moved over to this space and I've been working with nonprofit customers for over 2 decades now. And so I've learned a lot from being.
On the inside, but also from seeing my customers, what worked well and what didn't. And that's what we wanna share today and Ikram's gonna have some great insight on that as well. So mistakes, choosing the wrong ERP.
Can be a very expensive mistake. So if you don't have a framework and you don't have a process, I have seen many organizations overbuy and underutilize, and that's more common than you think. We've often been brought in where someone's brought this big solution and they spent a year.
Or two years implementing. They're not using half of it. There's a lack of ownership in the organization, poor adoption because it got too complicated too quickly. And again, that creates a lack of alignment across the organization and one of the big things.
That ends up happening when you go down this path is you end up with too much customization. So you know you've made a quick decision, you start to adopt, it's not meeting your needs. You create a customization and and next thing you know you're sort of chasing this perfect fit and it spirals out of control.
So it's it's really critical to spend the time before you go out to evaluate ERP to have clarity on what it is that you're looking for, what it is, what's important and what's not as important.
And that's what makes and and you know one thing that's really important is understanding the unique needs of of nonprofits because you have added pressures. As I said, I've been on the for profit and the nonprofit side and the nonprofit side was much more challenging because a you've got grant and fund based.
Accounting often some very specific projects you need to report to and some allocations. You've got compliance. A lot of our clients have some really complex compliant requirements that requires them to track transactions in a certain way. You've got board funding, you've got a government funding report.
And all of that with a really lean team and limited resources and and also often less experience with ERP. A lot of nonprofits, they have people that are very dedicated, that they've been there for years, they've used the same system and they don't even know how to approach an ERP project.
So before the project even starts, there's some change fatigue or there's some fear. So this is another reason why it is really critical to have a framework, because without that you don't have the structure, you get a lot of noise and and the project can start to derail a little bit before you even get started.
So again, what where what I see is that teams underestimate the time and effort needed. That happens all the time. I meet with nonprofits who, you know, they're just starting the process and they tell me they're going to make the decision in two months and and I can tell you that that rarely happens. It's usually two to three times.
more time before they make that decision, because it's only when they start to step into it that they realize that there's there's a lot of tentacles in this decision. So you really need to to start earlier than you ever expected that you would need to. Um Competing priorities between departments and trying to prioritize, that's another big challenge.
Challenge. And then also when you do get to the point where you are ready to do demos, you really need to have that framework to make sure you're evaluating or otherwise people get caught up in the bells and whistles and the demo wow and they end up choosing solutions that don't really meet their needs.
Additionally, you can get caught up in this whole endless feature comparison, which is not what you want to do. You want to understand your workflows. You want to understand how the system's going to support those workflows.
So 7 steps to build an ERP evaluation framework. First of all, assemble the right team and you're going to know who that is. You're going to know who those people are that are going to take ownership that that are really well respected. So people are going to respect their opinion. You want it to be a small cross-functional group, maybe 5 or.
Six people and and then go from there and and secondly you want to align on the why.
Define your pain points and goals. Prepare for the change management. Use an ERP fit assessment grid, which I'm I'm going to talk about each of these and then get be ready for your demo because that's a really critical part of that stage and make sure that you have the right approach to scoring and and reflecting your needs.
So let's step into each of these. So step one, assemble the team. As I said, you want to keep it small. You want it cross-functional. You want to make sure you have the right people that that others are going to look up to as well so that they they understand that they're in the right hands.
And that usually includes some leadership, but certainly key users within the organization. And you also want to aim for diversity of perspective, not just titles like that is really important. You want representation throughout the organization and and you want to make sure that you're using that team to drive adoption.
So having those people involved that are going to really champion the project.
And then, you know, this one wasn't originally part of our framework, but super critical. You want to align on the why. You know, you're in nonprofits. People have a mission. You know, there's a reason we have a mission statement. Well, it applies to an ERP project. You want to know what your why is for this.
this project? Why are you evaluating ERP? What are you trying to solve from inefficiencies? What are your goals? You know, what what are the key things that cross all departments? And that kind of why becomes your North Star as you're going through the challenging part of the
Of the project not only selecting, but also the the the challenging part of the implementation, which there's always challenges and implementations.
And then define your pain points and goals. So these are very much related to that. They're related to that. Why you know you want to define your pain points and your goals. You want to set some some workshops up. You want to have interviews with individual teams, but perhaps some group sessions.
And really understand what are causing the issues today. What's slowing you down? What could be easier and faster? What are the frustrations? But also you don't want it to be a complaining session. You really need to focus on what are the improvement ideas for those frustrations. So you know, we want real time budget.
Visibility. We want to control our spend management. We use too many spreadsheets, so nobody knows where to find information. Those are all the things that you want to identify and then understand how you're going to solve them. Like, hey, we're going to have a centralized system that's going to track all that information instead of spreadsheets.
And then once you get that, you need to shake this into your must haves and your nice haves and be prepared to make compromises because you're not going to find the perfect system. But what hopefully you'll find is something that's going to really solve those problems and be able to work through the workflows that you.
Require to support your organization. And then another thing that I have noticed is that the change management becomes something that's considered later in the process rather than earlier in the process.
I can't tell you how many projects where we get going and all of a sudden they realize that, wow, I didn't think about the fact that this change is going to impact this system and how this this integration works and how this workflow works. So you don't want to do that. You want to start preparing for change management upfront.
So when you gather that team, when you get your why, start thinking about, OK, what are the impacts? Who's gonna lead the change management? Don't rely on the vendor. Software vendors are gonna be able to help you with what the process should be around.
Their application? What's the best practices around their application? But you know your business, so you need to think about how does this application interact with other systems within our organization? What are the implications?
So I I I think, you know, I'm sure Ikram's going to talk about this, but that change management piece and establishing what that's going to look like early on is really important. And part of that is also bringing the skeptics in early. I had a I had an experience with that. I had a key person in our organization.
Who was very, very skeptical about the change and not a technology person at all and really was not interested in having to learn new tech. And so I strategically brought her into our project team because I knew if I could win her over that we would have a win across the organization.
And and she kind of came in kicking and screaming early on. But then she got super excited about learning something new and and in the end she actually became our champion. And and I I actually think it's one of the key reasons that our project was successful is she was sort of like if I can learn this, you can learn this and and she really helped bring.
The frontline workers along when we went live.
And then use an ERP fit assessment grid. So you know one common trap turning a giant checklist of features like just creating this big checklist of features for and and you know like oh it has to have a chart of accounts or it has to have X number of segments or it has to generate invoices.
Modern ERP's have all that, so try not to get down that trap. Try to be very specific on the things that are really important for your organization that are a little higher level. You know what are the finance complexities around your reporting work if you're looking for workforce management, what are?
Some of the challenges around union rules, what are some of the workflows that are really gonna make a difference for your organization? So really be careful that you don't get too caught up into those little week checkboxes and try to think about the broader aspects of your ERP.
And then from there go down into the specific features you need to make that happen.
Shortlist and demo and and structure your demos. So another key thing really critical for this framework is being diligent to shortlist two to three vendors at the most.
Anytime I've been in so many demos where there's five or six shortlisted, I've even recently was on one where there's 8 shortlisted. I can tell you that it overwhelms the teams that are trying to evaluate and I think in the end they almost conflate the different demos they see because they.
They do like 8 days of demos and no one really knows which product belong to what. You know, make sure you have a good grid so you can shortlist to two or three and then really spend time with those two or three to understand if you've got alignment there.
The other thing is be realistic about demo times. You you know you can't cover everything. So prioritize the critical workflows and prioritize the workflows that are really going to highlight the function and features that you need in order to to be successful with those workflows.
And think about the time involved to do that. Again, I see I'll get this demo script that is literally it would take us a day to do and we're given an hour and a half or two hours that it does not do anybody favors. You're just rushing through. People start to tune out.
You really need to think about those demos, so work with the vendor. You may not get it perfect, but be prepared to engage with the vendor. Vendors have lots of experience, so chat with them and work with them to establish the best demo and help them understand what it is you're trying to do.
To achieve, it'll be worth the time on both sides. And then again, guide your demos using real workflows. Highlight some of your pain points, not a generic checklist. Really critical as part of that, and that's really going to help you understand if the system supports your needs.
And then don't rush to a decision. You're down to those two. Take the time. Revisit your fit assessment grid. Consider deeper dives. I recommend that all the time. Even if you're down to two and you do 2 days of demos, it's still a lot for people.
We know how people learn. They often only retain 20% of what they learn in a day. Keep that in mind. Be prepared to do a deeper dive demo. Vendors love to do that and then then you can kind of go back and refine your scoring as needed.
And you know, and invite other departments to weigh in. Once you've done one with your core users, maybe you go and do something with some front line users and get their feedback. But you know, really critical not to rush that decision and make sure that you're comfortable with the technology and the partner that you're gonna work with.
So to summarize, like top tips, I would say from my experience, not only on the inside but also in my role for the past 20 years, don't expect a perfect fit. You know, no system is going to match your processes, as I said earlier around the.
Change Management. The vendor will help you with what the processes should look like based on how the application works. Be prepared to embrace that. Be prepared to make changes in your process cuz your process has been driven by your current application, which likely isn't optimized. You don't want to start going down the customization path.
Because ultimately it's more expensive to support and it actually can result in lower adoption. Engage with the vendor. Once you've got that short list, be prepared to have a conversation. Be prepared to work and have the best demo experience you can, and it'll give you an indication of what that.
Bender's gonna be like to work with. And then, as I said earlier, invite skeptics in early. People like to feel heard. And if you can get those skeptics so that everyone says, well, if it's like that old commercial, you know, let's get Mikey, you know, the cereal commercial, you know, he eats the cereal if he likes it.
Everybody likes it. Prepare to embrace that kind of approach with your team.
OK, well, now for the part that's going to be the most interesting. Let's hear from someone who has lived this and navigated very successfully. I've got Ikram. Brianne mentioned Ikram earlier at the beginning of the session, but Ikram is.
Here back in Canada, after a a very exciting trip doing some hiking and Ikram, maybe you can share really quickly what you've been up to the last few weeks.

 
Ikram Zouari   24:25
Thank you, Meg. Yes, I just returned from an amazing hike. It's 11 days hike in the Alps. So, so I'm physically exhausted but mentally mentally rebirthed. So it was amazing. It was 160 kilometer over 11 days crossing 3.
Countries in the Alps, Italy, France and Switzerland. So I encourage you to check it out. 
Meg Wilson   24:49
Good for you. Good for you. Yeah. Well and and and Ikram, I I've had a chance to interact with you for some time and I know that you are very good at at at getting over obstacles so I can understand how climbing mountains and.
It would be, uh, really attractive to you. So, yeah, exactly. And you went through an ERP implementation, so you know what it's like. It's a little bit like climbing a mountain. You have those ups and downs when you're going through it, but in the end, you finish at the top and celebrate.

Ikram Zouari   25:11
Yes, it gives you that push.
Yeah.
Yeah, I see those mountains at the sprints. You go up and down and you finish go up and down. So that's exactly.

 
Meg Wilson   25:32
Yeah, there we go. Perfect analogy. All right. So we'd love to get your perspective. So maybe besides your hike, you can share a little bit about yourself and your experience implementing a cloud ERP solution. 
Ikram Zouari   25:49
Yeah. So I've been at the NIC for three years now when I was brought in to actually implement the system and with my experience with implementing systems. So I was before at the museum, the Kennedy Museum of Nature and I'll, I'll speak, but I was about to implement the system and then I left.Meg Wilson   26:08
No.

Ikram Zouari   26:09
At that time, but I was able to upgrade the system, was a major upgrade of the system as well. I do have experience as well in in in the private sector and especially is the the high tech. So I my experience was specifically in a high tech and then I moved to the.
To the government and not-for-profit since 2012. So I implemented a lot of cloud-based system in high tech like SAP, Oracle, Sage, Jackpack. So these so many system and then I moved in the government where it's it's I've done GD Edwards and then I did Sparkrock as well.
In Agrasu in one of the crown corporations. So not they are not cloud, but it's the major cloud ERP system that I implemented is Sparkrock with the with the NIC and the NIC is actually what makes it unique to its two implementation. It's because we also have the foundation of the NIC.
So it's it's an implementation of the NAC organization which is a public sector accounting, but also the implementation of the NAC Foundation which is fund accounting. They are two different implementation, two different way of accounting. 
Meg Wilson   27:23
Right, right. Great. Well, thank you for that overview. Well, listen, we walk, I walked through the the steps to build an ERP evaluation framework. Is there anything that you'd like to expand on or highlight based on all that amazing experience you have with all the different systems and and most recently with with moving?
To Sparkrock.

Ikram Zouari   27:43
Yeah, so much. I mean you summarized it very well. The only thing I would like to add is, is really the organ, your organization, your the whole organization will need to be prepared to adjust their current processes to the new system and not the opposite like you don't adjust the system.
System to your current process. It's rethinking your process to be able to use the system as is without customization, and that requires some work in front. It's documenting. So what we've done, we documented the processes so we can understand them. We met each department, we documented the.
Process and we ask as you mentioned what you need to improve, but also when we looked at it is we looked at it from a way. How can I change those process to fit the new system without having to customize? But if we have to then how can we minimize it? So that is where I really.
It's important in those 5-5 steps not to forget that rethink your process, be prepared to rethink your process and the change management process is very important there to be able to get that buying of all the departments.

Meg Wilson   28:53
Right. So you would agree like that change management has to start right at the beginning right before you're even out meeting with vendors is is is getting a buy in. And and I'd say it's a real testament to you Ikram, because you also need a really strong leader for that to happen like like for people to to be willing to change their processes.

Ikram Zouari   29:00
Exactly. Yeah. Yeah.

Meg Wilson   29:12
They're often married to them because they've been doing so long. So it also takes a real strong leader as part of that. So I, you know, I'd like to commend you on that piece because I know, I I know that was a lot of change. You know, anyone that knows anything about the National Arts Center, it's so diverse.

Ikram Zouari   29:15
Yes. 
Meg Wilson   29:31
Right. Like all the different programs you offer and and to your point, you've got two separate entities that run differently. So, so kudos on that one.

Ikram Zouari   29:40
And I I have to say like it took us a year to do that right before even we go to the procurement process. So take your time as you mentioned Meg, like we took us a year to actually go through all the department, discuss with them and start. We're implementing a new system. We do not want to keep those process, we want to rethink them to this new system, so. 
Meg Wilson   29:47
Right.
Yeah. 
Ikram Zouari   30:00
Start preparing them a year ahead.

Meg Wilson   30:01
Yeah, yeah. And that's where again, a lot of customers, they underestimate. That's why the timepiece is so important. And also we have a lot of organizations where there aren't products that are end of life and they're kind of starting to think about it a year before their end of life. No, you really want to start earlier. You can't do it.
A bit too early, but you can run out of time and that can compromise the results. OK, so so as part of your RFP you developed a detailed like you not only had your functional requirements, but the other thing that you did that not everybody does is you created a statement of work and you outlined.
Find what you thought the phases should look like, including vendor support. And I think that was super valuable because again, to my point around having discussion with the vendor, when you get down to the two or three vendors, it's important to have the discussion. So I'd love for you to elaborate on why you did that and.
What your what your feedback is on that?Ikram Zouari   31:04
Yeah, we consider the statement of work is a reference document throughout the implementation. So as we advance in the implementation, we always refer to that document. Are we within that statement of work? So it's really provides you clarity with the vendors. So you're you, we both work from one document going to the evaluation criteria and the. 
Meg Wilson   31:18
Right.

Ikram Zouari   31:24
Is too long. So you want to have that somebody document that has your milestones, what's in those milestones summary. So and and and we had to go to that statement of work throughout the implementation to make sure, oh, this was included, this is was not included.

Meg Wilson   31:38
Yeah.

Ikram Zouari   31:39
Where, where, where are our responsibility? Where is the vendor responsibility? So that way it's really provides and defines the scope, defines the objectives, it defines the timelines and also provides identify the risks and mitigation strategy. Because when you put everything you know where you may be short on as. 
Meg Wilson   31:57
Yeah. 
Ikram Zouari   31:58
As with within your team and you provide those mitigation strategy to to to ensure that you're covering those risky areas. So it was really helpful for us and it made it more efficient. 
Meg Wilson   32:08
Yeah. And what you guys did that was interesting that I don't see is that you guys wrote that statement of work from your perspective as part of your RFP process. As a vendor, we always have our own and and it follows our implementation. But because you wrote one, it gave us a really good opportunity to sit down to say, well.
Here's our template. Let's make sure we're incorporating the things that are important for you, and we're using our statement of work so you understand our process. Because our statement of work is designed similar to what you were talking about processes. It's designed to reflect our technology, our.
Software and how we implement. So I I find it really valuable when organizations have thought about what their statement of work looks like. It creates better dialogue. It helps you set expectations and make sure that you've thought about everything. So when the vendor presents their statement of work.
You you know you you you know how to dot the I's and cross the T's. 
Ikram Zouari   33:10
Yeah, and it gives you an opportunity to actually also yourself read the statement of the work of the vendor and compare it and align. It's literally like a summary document for you, an opportunity to actually go through everything and understanding in your own language that your team understand, your project management understands so.
As actually was very helpful. 
Meg Wilson   33:31
Yeah, yes, yeah, great. I I think that was great work on your team's part. So what pitfalls do you think nonprofit finance leaders face when selecting a cloud ERP? And I say cloud ERP because it's a little different, like when you move from where you've got total control over your own infrastructure and you can do.
Whatever you want, you move into a cloud, there's a little more, there's a little more structure, right? So curious what you have to say about that. 
Ikram Zouari   33:59
So cloud is for us, I mean the SaaS, the cloud is always a positive thing because now you're you're it's it's kind of more secure than having something hosted in your server. So it is actually a positive thing and it was a positive kind of transition to a cloud when you when you talk about cloud 
Meg Wilson   34:08
Yeah.
Yeah. 
Ikram Zouari   34:18
So I think, I think I would, I would talk about it from in general selecting a cloud ERP or selecting an ERP system. I make a cloud is more about making sure that where your data is stored or hosted. 
Meg Wilson   34:33
Mhm.

Ikram Zouari   34:33
As as a government, because we are a government, we have to make sure it is in Canada, not in the US. So there is some restriction in that, but maybe for others it's different. So for I think in general is and you spoke about it, it's choosing the wrong system.
And and over customizing and and and also you don't have the right team because it's very important in within your organization before you actually start looking at an ERP system, you do have the right team to implement that system. 
Meg Wilson   34:51
Right.
Mhm.

Ikram Zouari   35:08
So one of the things that we have done before I implement the system is I actually build the team for it. So I've been three years at the NIC before I even thinking about my first year is building that team to be able for me to implement an ERP cloud system that's sophisticated, has automation, has access. 
Meg Wilson   35:19
Mhm.

Ikram Zouari   35:28
Control has data control. So I brought in a system administrator, a CPA who's data scientist, and I brought in a BI person to help me because these are the people who's going to manage the system, but I brought them ahead of time.

Meg Wilson   35:36
Oh.

Ikram Zouari   35:43
So they can learn the system as they implement it. And that was the that was very successful for us because those two people is actually they were the change management people. They knew how to use data, they knew how to use Power BI, they knew how to actually benefit from the system.
To and we did the train the trainer, so they were trained to train other and and that was actually something that really helped us with the implementation. 
Meg Wilson   36:11
Yeah, that's great. That's a really good point. And I think the train the trainer is the only way to go. If you can't create some of those particular individuals in your organization to train your other users, then you're gonna have a lot.
A little bit of a failure there. You really need those people that are going to drive the change, that understand the processes around it and understand the data and the application. So, you know, I I'm always a little concerned when people are looking for just sort of training to be pushed at them. You need to own that training as an organization.
Yeah, so real points. 
Ikram Zouari   36:51
And I I can give an example what we've done and I think it worked very well and I didn't see it another organization. So the way I've done it six months or three months to the go live, I started Monday series, they're called know your new system, know the new finance system.Meg Wilson   37:06
Yeah.

Ikram Zouari   37:09
And it's 30 minute. We bring all the budget holder and we talk about the new system. That's what's going to do. These are the feature. This is the path forward and it's called know your new system then post.

Meg Wilson   37:21
Oh, that's awesome.

Ikram Zouari   37:22
That is what I've done like 3 months before and then post go live we created a weekly session 30 minutes. We don't give too much information because when you when you load overload people with information they forget. So it's a 30 sessions every time we do it specific training for those budget holder or the.
Users and then the week after we do a QA session. So you've done this session where I trained you. The week after would be questions and answers and we're still doing them till now. Now we are like a year after implementation. We're still doing those training session this week. The next week is QA session and.
They were very successful, very successful in terms of training. 
Meg Wilson   38:06
Wow, I love that. I I can't say that I've heard another customer do it. I like maybe for a couple of months after, but you know anyone who's used Excel, it's a good example, right? I can guarantee you you maybe if you're really sophisticated, you know 50% of the features and like in it like.
The ERP has so much to help people in their day-to-day work. So being able to continue to learn like that, that is fantastic. Wow, that's that. And I love that you're still doing them. Do you think you'll continue? 
Ikram Zouari   38:29
Correct.
Yeah.
We are, yes. We will continue to do them until we feel all users are comfortable, but we still because we're in phase two and implementation as well. So we think we will continue to do them because also we implemented Power BI which is another thing reporting. So we will continue to do them until we feel all users are comfortable. 
Meg Wilson   38:52
Yeah.

Ikram Zouari   38:58
No longer attending. There is no more questions. When we see that we will do them every once a month instead of or we do lunch and learn until we feel that everyone is comfortable. But we should not drop those trainings because you've got a new user every time coming in.

Meg Wilson   39:13
Right, right. OK, well, that's fantastic. So let let me just backtrack a bit. So what? I'm just curious, what were the pain points or red flags that made you realize that it was time for a new system like when you started all this and. 
Ikram Zouari   39:27
I mean, for us, it's easy to say it was the fall of red flag. I came in and I said this system must be replaced. It's not supported. It's it's a system. I mean, it's called Sun System. I've never heard about it's. 
Meg Wilson   39:41
No.

Ikram Zouari   39:44
It's not supported, it's manual. So for us was it that there is no access control, there is no data control, failed the IT audit. So it was like a system. I refused to get access to it. I was like this system must be replaced. That said, I did not replace till year 3.

Meg Wilson   40:00
Yeah.

Ikram Zouari   40:04
Because I had to do all my work before I replaced. So I did. I built my team, start learning the system, then went to the procurement. And so my third year I implemented the system. I took my time to learn as well.

Meg Wilson   40:18
Yeah, yeah, no, that makes a lot of sense. I I I'm sure that helped with the success of this project is is understanding that. And then I I I'd also allowed you to evaluate your team to your point or or and and bring in people if you thought you had a gap because it sounds like you brought in a couple of people.

Ikram Zouari   40:30
Correct. Yeah, I'm back down.

Meg Wilson   40:37
You mentioned, yeah, awesome. So then when you did that, what did you guys do in terms of creating your requirements and and then and and shortlisting your vendors? You know, what feedback can you provide for the people attending today on on that whole process? 
Ikram Zouari   40:38
Yeah.
So as I mentioned a year before that procurement process, there was meeting with the department where we documented the process that they currently have and we and we asked them about what what you want to what what would what would the new system.
Wanted to do for you like how how the new system will make your life easier and what you want to know, what you want to get as a data analysis from the new system. So that's what we've done. We really documented all that and based on that we actually created those requirement, those technical requirements. 
Meg Wilson   41:10
Mhm.

Ikram Zouari   41:28
Requirements as well. So to make sure that what we need is in there in that system and we create an evaluation team from different departments. So what I've done is we've got department with larger budgets, so definitely they are there. 
Meg Wilson   41:45
Mhm.

Ikram Zouari   41:45
And we brought in outsider as well. So we brought a project manager that that it's it's they have a very good experience with finance system implementation and we brought user as you mentioned that they know know nothing about finance. 

Ikram Zouari   42:04
A user who they will ask those questions that we wanted them to ask from a user perspective. So challenge us as as as evaluator, finance evaluator. So there is a non finance and finance evaluator sponsor and and the project manager there that helped us with evaluation.

Meg Wilson   42:24
Yeah, that's great. And then and then when you shortlisted, how did you approach the demos, the shortlisting and and the demo approach so that you got the most value out of that process?

Ikram Zouari   42:33
So the short list is based on the technical requirements, so the demo would be like the last, the last to actually evaluate on. So once we kind of shortlisted our vendors on the technical requirement, we've done the demos.
The demo, it's based on our understanding from those requirements, the technical requirements and if we have any questions. So we did our homework, we read all these requirements, we were very comfortable, but if we have any clarification and questions, we wanted to use the demo to respond to that. So we're not just going into the demo to.
We can't do it in in in in one hour or half an hour for a demo. So we wanted really to target what we wanted to understand from the vendor or if we have any additional questions and we provided those questions ahead of time. So that way the demo is actually efficient. So the vendor is coming knowing what our question.
Knowing what we want to know and what we want to hear from them and what we wanted them to focus on more, and that made the demo more efficient. 
Meg Wilson   43:38
Yeah. And if I recall, cause I was part of that process too, we we did do some deeper dives like we went back to like look at budgeting and forecasting for example, cause we had a couple of different ways we could approach it. So you know I I did you find that really added value doing that and and got people comfortable?

Ikram Zouari   43:47
Correct.
Exactly that really because we had at that time I think because the upgrade was to to happen during the implementation. So we we wanted to understand what's the current version is, what's the new version is going to give us to ensure that it actually responds to our need.
And and we saw that in the requirement, the response requirement. So we wanted to get more information about and that's why we wanted to focus on. So it's actually you do your homework, you don't get into the demo when you haven't read your technical requirement because you've done it already and then based on that you provide your questions. So your demo is actually more efficient. 
Meg Wilson   44:23
Right.
Right. 
Ikram Zouari   44:34
It's providing you additional responses to to that technical requirement document, so you're not duplicating the effort as well for the vendor and for your team.

Meg Wilson   44:44
Yes, yes, very good, very good process. And as a vendor, I appreciate that. OK. So looking back now we we talked, we've covered so many things. You've talked about how you've you've gathered internal buy in, you've helped with the change management. I I absolutely love your. 
Ikram Zouari   44:49
Mhm.

Meg Wilson   45:04
Your Monday sessions, I think that is, uh, brilliant and every customer should do it. Um, but what? You know what? Are there anything that any advice you'd give or anything that didn't go as well as you would have thought that you would do differently before we wrap up and go into the Q&A?

Ikram Zouari   45:22
I I think and I think it was successful for us was Park Rock because there is very important thing, the sponsor. So I was the sponsor, but I was a sponsor who's hands on. I was in every meeting, I was helping my team, asking the question, challenging everyone. So it is important that the sponsor is involved.
And it's hands on to be able to help that communication from the team and the and and and Sparkrock team. So if there is any issue you talk about it right away, you don't leave it to the end, you address it and we did have issue and we addressed it.
So that's important and and and there is one thing I would like to talk about here because very important for Sparkrock is and what what was really helped the team in terms of the way that Sparkrock implements the implementation method. It's a Sprint, it's you learn about the system.

Meg Wilson   45:57
Yeah. 
Ikram Zouari   46:16
So you learn about the system, then you go back, you do test scripts and then you go to your process how you can, how you can make them fit to that system. So it is actually it's a Sprint implementation where you actually take your time and the team learns about the system, not just them.
They do the implementation for you. You actually do it for yourself, with your own team, with the help of the subject expert matter. So you can stop and you say, you know what? In many times we had to call the subject expert matter to say, you know what, I need to understand this. I did not understand it. So it was like a. 
Meg Wilson   46:41
Right.

Ikram Zouari   46:55
Collaborative effort between the vendor and the NAC team to be able to understand the system so we can make it work for us and that is very critical and very important when you have your sponsor is involved. 
Meg Wilson   46:59
OK.
Yes, that's really good feedback. And for those super quick on what we mean by Sprint is the old day, you'd sit down with the vendor and what are your requirements? How do you want to work? And it would go off into a black box and they'd configure it and give it back to you and then you'd be like, this doesn't meet my needs at all. That's not what we do. We pick a particular area.
It's accounts payable. We'll use it as an example and we train people on how to use accounts payable, train them to understand it so that when you're making configuration decisions, you understand the implication. So that's really what Ikram's talking about. We would do each major area by these sprints and then at the end.
You do a test of the whole system, 'cause obviously it all needs to work, but that's really fantastic feedback. I love hearing that.
So anything else? Any advice? I think you gave some amazing advice, amazing ideas. Anything else, Ikram, before we turn it over to the Q&A? 
Ikram Zouari   48:10
I think I said it all. I mean, I would I I welcome any questions so I can target specific questions for the audience. 
Meg Wilson   48:19
All right. Well, I think Bree is gonna assist us with questions, so.
Let's go. I free.

Bri-anna Ramsden   48:29
Hello. If you have any questions, feel free to pop them in the Q&A or the chat. I did have a couple to get started with cause we had some submitted before. So one that I like thinking about cause I used to work in nonprofits for a very long time and I had the fun job of not being in finance but being given a budget.
Which is, I'm sure you know, it's always fun. You always wish you had more. How do you balance the must have functionality with budget and resource constraints when you're evaluating vendors?

Ikram Zouari   49:02
That's part of the RFP. So when you go in even with the RFP, you're you're and and even choosing the vendor. So the budget is in consideration for sure and and in terms of so for us for example, there is a core functionality for an ERP system that you cannot actually reduce, you need to have your payable.
Receivable asset and all that procurement. But there is something, let's say we did not do now inventory because we don't have a large inventory, we have just a small inventory. So we said, you know what, we'll not do it now, we'll do it after because that is going to impact our resources or our budget.
You look at what's critical for you. Your should. I call them me. What I call them is must, should, nice. You have a three category. Must is like you have to, you have to pay people, you have to create invoices, you have to have a procurement. Should is what makes me more efficient.
Nice is the nice to have. So if you have a budget constraint so you're you're only focus on the shirt and on a mast and then you could move a little bit to the shirt and then you could go to the nice after. So that is how I I I categorize them.
In my mind, in terms of from a budget perspective.

Meg Wilson   50:22
But did you like related to that, I just wanna add, but you're also looking for a platform that would give you those should and nices that you could eventually implement, yeah. 
Bri-anna Ramsden   50:22
Excited.

Ikram Zouari   50:31
Correct.
And we did that. So when we asked, we said we want to see integration. So our phase three is integration, but we don't have the money to do them now, but we want to make sure the system can do that. So in the requirement where was even though this is not in scope now, I want to make sure you can do it and it came as yes, I can do it, but. 
Meg Wilson   50:33
Yeah.
Right.

Ikram Zouari   50:52
I'm not going to do them now. That's my phase three. But you want to make sure the system is capable of capable of doing your should and nice.

Meg Wilson   50:55
Yeah.

Bri-anna Ramsden   51:03
Fantastic lines up with what I was thinking too, being able to grow as you get used to the system and more comfortable. 
Ikram Zouari   51:12
Correct and and and and one of the advice I would say you don't have to do it all the first year, take your time. So when I presented the approach of the implementation of the system, I gave them a three years approach just for the core functionality. Be realistic in your goals.
Because you don't want to, don't expect everybody to know your system year one. You're still stabilizing. Remember, when you're implementing a new system, you're still stabilizing your system for three years. After three years, your system is stabilized and you can move on to the next.
So don't I wouldn't, I wouldn't really implement all feature at once. You go slowly, but make sure those features are available in the system and this is what we did. We know they are available. We're going to go slow in implementing them. So I haven't implemented approval in the system yet.
For invoices, but we know we can do them, but that is year 2, year 3 where I am going kind of to turn on that features feature and we go slowly because I need to prep everybody. I need to get the buy in of everyone and I need to make sure they are prepped to that heavily automated structure. So I need to get them used to the structure.
Structure 1st and then it goes slowly to get them grow with that structure thinking to to move them really. If not, you will fail. It will be a Phoenix story. I always use Phoenix open everything without training. That's a Phoenix story.

Meg Wilson   52:38
Yeah.
Great reference for sure.

Bri-anna Ramsden   52:46
Well, I love it. That shows you care about your team, right? You're not just throwing everything at the wall, hoping it works. It's let's get there together.

Ikram Zouari   52:49
Exactly, yeah.
Yeah, we want

Meg Wilson   52:54
Well, and it also, it shows you care about your, you understand your organization and the capability for change. I mean, you've got, they've got a lot of things on their plate day-to-day. So yeah, yeah, awesome.

Ikram Zouari   53:02
Alright.
And you wanted them motivated. You wanted them. They wanted to do it. And and and I mean your project, project management team, Meg, they always felt that actually the team is empowered. They want to do the job and you can have your team empowered if the sponsor is not involved.
Because they feel your sponsor cares, I care. They they they need to get motivated. It's an additional task on them. It's actually we we we had to do it with the resources we have. So to to to to make them, to make them feel they are empowered. They need to feel you're involved, you're with them.

Meg Wilson   53:26
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah. 
Ikram Zouari   53:43
On this. 
Meg Wilson   53:43
Yeah, yeah, that makes so much sense. And then also to your point earlier, if you run into an issue, like if you haven't been involved, you're not really going to understand the issues because sometimes they they they have tentacles, right? Like and you need to have been involved in some of the earlier discussions to understand so.
That that's great feedback. So I I I'm just curious kind of related to that question, Brianne, that was submitted. So how would you recommend establishing a budget? Did you guys establish your budget beforehand? Um, did you have it like had you kind of gone out to market to understand what what it was gonna cost you?
Or how did you approach that? 
Ikram Zouari   54:24
We didn't know how much it's going to cost us. We did establish a budget beforehand. Now for us, we did receive funding from the government specific for the implementation of of three systems. Part of them is the finance. So we knew what the government gave us. 
Meg Wilson   54:29
Mhm.
OK. 
Ikram Zouari   54:42
To be able actually to and we had a budget for it and we went, we went out and we had an open bid and we went with the now the budget was not the only kind of the only measure is the technical requirement as well. We could find somebody who's cheaper, but if it's the technical. 
Meg Wilson   54:43
Right.

Ikram Zouari   55:02
The clinical requirement is not good and if we don't feel comfortable with that vendor, we're not going to do it. What is the best value for your organization? That is what we needed. We looked at the best value and our procurement is is the best value for the NAC, not the cheaper. It's the best value for the NAC. 
Meg Wilson   55:09
Right. 
Ikram Zouari   55:19
And what we do is we said, OK, if it's over budget, maybe we can scope as long as we know that the system can do the work and we could do it in phases. We take what we need right now and then when we have money, we can infuse that money and we and we do more and we do more. So this is how we approach the implementation. We had a preset budget.
Then we worked within that budget to phase the implementation.

Meg Wilson   55:42
Gotcha. Gotcha. That's awesome. Is there any other questions, Bree?

Bri-anna Ramsden   55:49
Yes, we'll do one more and we can start closing up. We talked about the importance of internal buy-in because obviously we need to get everyone on board. But do you have any specific strategies or examples of where you successfully turned a skeptic into a champion?

Ikram Zouari   56:08
Yes.

Meg Wilson   56:08
That's a I like that question.

Ikram Zouari   56:11
Yes, because because in our implementation everyone can provide an opinion and can challenge any process and if they come with a great idea.
And if they ask the questions and we find that their idea is great, it becomes an idea. So it was open to everyone. So in in those Monday meeting we had a lot of we had, we had admins from our department that they become involved.
And I said, you know what, you have the right to be skeptical. You challenge what process or whatever we want to do. And if it does work for us, we will implement it. And we have implemented a lot of stuff that way. So you bring in people together and they feel actually involved when you take their and the idea.

Meg Wilson   56:56
Hmm.

Ikram Zouari   57:02
To champion it. So we had, we had, I had English theater. They had an admin. She's lovely. She's so empowered of the finance system and implementation. And she provided a lot of ideas in terms of how the new cost centers will look like because we changed everything.
We haven't changed what the cost center, the cost center we use, the numbers, the project codes. We changed all that. But we went to them and I said, how do you want it? How do you want it to make sense to you? Because we want to use the best practice and we got the feedback from many admin we wanted. 
Meg Wilson   57:29
OK. 
Ikram Zouari   57:40
We want it this way. No, no, we should be this way. So it's not like we said we're finance. We're the one who decides how the call center will look like. No, we got their ideas and we went with the idea with one of the administrative assistant of English Theater, which was like, this is a brilliant.
We're going to go with this. That is what we are going to use. And it was a collective like she was so happy. And after that she's the one who actually reviewed every form, new form I implemented.

Meg Wilson   58:09
Wow, that. 
Ikram Zouari   58:10
Like she reviewed every work that I've done and she she actually helped the finance team doing that till yesterday. Yesterday she she she she she invited me in a meeting. I said I want to talk to you. I want to change the form that you do for a capital asset. What do you think? And I'm like this is great. Let's do it. Let's talk. 
Bri-anna Ramsden   58:10
That's good. 
Ikram Zouari   58:29
About it, I love it and let's and and and let's change that. So you actually, if you bring, if you make them make people feel comfortable that they can bring changes to a process as long as it makes sense and it's aligned with the best practice and you tell them there is decision when they said no, we can't do that and I'll explain to you why we cannot do it.
It's because of this Sentinel controls. We have auditors that they do this. I cannot do that, but this I can do.

Bri-anna Ramsden   58:56
Mhm.

Ikram Zouari   58:57
So we we changed activity codes, we changed dimensions and all that. We changed it in the collaboration with the department, not just us.

Meg Wilson   59:05
I love that that that is amazing cause to your point, it's usually finance sort of saying this is the way we want it because you're focused on board reporting and external reporting. But an organization like the NAC where they're all responsible, English theatre is responsible for managing all these different projects and these different events and.
Yeah, it's critical that it works for them as well, so.

Ikram Zouari   59:29
Correct. Because I told them GL accounts, I can't change that's accounting, but call center is yours. I want you when you do a call center, you understand it. It's not imposed on you. So when you see it is actually you know it. So they created their own call centers the way they wanted them and each department created. 
Meg Wilson   59:36
Right. 
Ikram Zouari   59:49
Them the way they wanted them as long as it goes with I said, you know what, these are the rules we wanted them because this is how the dimension work, but you're free to do whatever you want. So we did a new activity code we did based on how they want it and it was easy to train after. 
Ikram Zouari   1:00:04
Because they knew it.

Meg Wilson   1:00:04
Yeah, right. Awesome. Well, I think we're getting near to the end of time here. We've got one minute left, but this has been just an amazing. I've done a few of these fireside chats and I think this is the best one yet. Ikram, thank you. I think I know you said you're tired from all that hiking physically, but. 
Ikram Zouari   1:00:21
Maybe welcome.

Meg Wilson   1:00:24
Your mental, your mental acuity is there like this was a fantastic session and really great feedback and ideas for for prospective customers that might be looking for a new ERP and going through this process. 
Ikram Zouari   1:00:28
Yeah.
And thank you, Meg, for this opportunity. I really would like to help other organization with our experience because I think we had, it was a very successful implementation. So it's good if we can offer that learning experience for everyone.

Meg Wilson   1:00:57
All right. Well, Bree, anything any? I just want to make sure we're not missing anything. Otherwise, thanks everybody for joining us. This has been wonderful. I I hope to do another one of these, but I don't know whether anyone's going to be at a top Ikram here, so.
So, but again, have a great rest of your day, folks. Thanks so much for joining us. 
Ikram Zouari   1:01:21
Thank you so much. Thanks. Bye, bye. 
Bri-anna Ramsden   1:01:22
Thank you. Have a great day, everyone.